Growing Together: Open Forum

Hi,

I also wanted a greenhouse at our school, until I found out the loops we had to go through. Not only the fire marshall but we would have needed to get an architect involved and then submit it to the State Architects department. Due to the costs and steps involved, we halted the project. I still think about trying again from time to time though!

------------------------------
ziva santop
zivasantopziva
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-06-2022 11:20:33 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

This is the first time that I am posting a question here as I am needing some info.  I teach at a small northern MN public school and we are wanting to build a greenhouse.  Due to our long winter season, we would like to have it heated and essentially be used year-round.  While in the planning stages, we are running into many rules and guidelines by the fire marshall and designers of what this structure has to follow in order to have students present using it.  This is driving up the costs considerably.  I am wondering if other schools that have newer greenhouses built recently had to go through a lot of guidelines or if other older structures needed improvements made?  Our main one is fire suppression with a sprinkler system from the ceiling and materials that are more bricks and mortar with glass windows.  Our school wants to do this correctly but I'm not sure we can afford what is being designed.  I know there are grants out there but it's trying to find the time to write them is my problem.  Curious of what others had to face.  Thank you!

--

Mrs. Christine Mackai

4th Grade Elementary and HS Band Director

Northeast Range School

Hello 

We have a pretty simple green house dated back to maybe 15 years ago and it's falling apart.  We decided to shop for a couple on Amazon from grant money. I'm not sure the size you need but I've seen some big enough to work in. Also depending on how sturdy you can make it. Just a thought


------------------------------
Shella Moritz
Macolm C. Hursey Elementary
N. Charleston SC
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-06-2022 11:20:33 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

This is the first time that I am posting a question here as I am needing some info.  I teach at a small northern MN public school and we are wanting to build a greenhouse.  Due to our long winter season, we would like to have it heated and essentially be used year-round.  While in the planning stages, we are running into many rules and guidelines by the fire marshall and designers of what this structure has to follow in order to have students present using it.  This is driving up the costs considerably.  I am wondering if other schools that have newer greenhouses built recently had to go through a lot of guidelines or if other older structures needed improvements made?  Our main one is fire suppression with a sprinkler system from the ceiling and materials that are more bricks and mortar with glass windows.  Our school wants to do this correctly but I'm not sure we can afford what is being designed.  I know there are grants out there but it's trying to find the time to write them is my problem.  Curious of what others had to face.  Thank you!

--

Mrs. Christine Mackai

4th Grade Elementary and HS Band Director

Northeast Range School

Hi Christine,
Have you checked out Growing Spaces in Pagosa Springs, CO?  https://growingspaces.com/
They have geodesic dome greenhouse kits of various sizes. These growing domes have solar panels and several features which add to the energy efficiency. They are designed to be off-grid.

We purchased an 18-foot dome several years ago and may, hopefully, start installation next spring. The 18-foot has an area of 250 square-feet and anything over 200-square-feet has to go through city permitting under our school district rules. This permitting, along with other district requirements for a "permanent" structure...along with COVID... has seriously slowed down installation of our dome.  So check on those size/permitting requirements  for your district.

I've toured a dome like this in Truckee CA and an convinced that, once built, this will be a great addition to our school's garden program.

Good luck, Linda

------------------------------
Linda Hulen
Anchorage AK
907 2501837
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-06-2022 11:20:33 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

This is the first time that I am posting a question here as I am needing some info.  I teach at a small northern MN public school and we are wanting to build a greenhouse.  Due to our long winter season, we would like to have it heated and essentially be used year-round.  While in the planning stages, we are running into many rules and guidelines by the fire marshall and designers of what this structure has to follow in order to have students present using it.  This is driving up the costs considerably.  I am wondering if other schools that have newer greenhouses built recently had to go through a lot of guidelines or if other older structures needed improvements made?  Our main one is fire suppression with a sprinkler system from the ceiling and materials that are more bricks and mortar with glass windows.  Our school wants to do this correctly but I'm not sure we can afford what is being designed.  I know there are grants out there but it's trying to find the time to write them is my problem.  Curious of what others had to face.  Thank you!

--

Mrs. Christine Mackai

4th Grade Elementary and HS Band Director

Northeast Range School

I visited a school in CO that had one of these.  The garden coordinator who inherited it didn't have much nice to say about them.  Panels had fallen out and were in places that were very difficult to replace.  She had high winds where it was located.  She also noted that it was hard to maximize the space and still make it so a whole class could fit inside -- I don't remember the size of hers.  

They are super cool looking though!

------------------------------
Kirsten Saylor
Saint Paul MN
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-08-2022 11:39:10 AM
From: Linda Hulen
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi Christine,
Have you checked out Growing Spaces in Pagosa Springs, CO?  https://growingspaces.com/
They have geodesic dome greenhouse kits of various sizes. These growing domes have solar panels and several features which add to the energy efficiency. They are designed to be off-grid.

We purchased an 18-foot dome several years ago and may, hopefully, start installation next spring. The 18-foot has an area of 250 square-feet and anything over 200-square-feet has to go through city permitting under our school district rules. This permitting, along with other district requirements for a "permanent" structure...along with COVID... has seriously slowed down installation of our dome.  So check on those size/permitting requirements  for your district.

I've toured a dome like this in Truckee CA and an convinced that, once built, this will be a great addition to our school's garden program.

Good luck, Linda

------------------------------
Linda Hulen
Anchorage AK
907 2501837

Original Message:
Sent: 12-06-2022 11:20:33 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

This is the first time that I am posting a question here as I am needing some info.  I teach at a small northern MN public school and we are wanting to build a greenhouse.  Due to our long winter season, we would like to have it heated and essentially be used year-round.  While in the planning stages, we are running into many rules and guidelines by the fire marshall and designers of what this structure has to follow in order to have students present using it.  This is driving up the costs considerably.  I am wondering if other schools that have newer greenhouses built recently had to go through a lot of guidelines or if other older structures needed improvements made?  Our main one is fire suppression with a sprinkler system from the ceiling and materials that are more bricks and mortar with glass windows.  Our school wants to do this correctly but I'm not sure we can afford what is being designed.  I know there are grants out there but it's trying to find the time to write them is my problem.  Curious of what others had to face.  Thank you!

--

Mrs. Christine Mackai

4th Grade Elementary and HS Band Director

Northeast Range School

Hey Christine! What size greenhouse are you hoping to build and what is your estimated cost with these requirements (and/or your ideal budget)?

@Nathan Larson, @Erica Krug, and @Hawthorn McCracken are connected with a lot of school gardens in Wisconsin. Do any of you know of any programs with greenhouses that Christine could connect with?  ​

​​​​

------------------------------
Amelia Dupuis
Kids Garden Community Manager
KidsGardening
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-06-2022 11:20:33 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

This is the first time that I am posting a question here as I am needing some info.  I teach at a small northern MN public school and we are wanting to build a greenhouse.  Due to our long winter season, we would like to have it heated and essentially be used year-round.  While in the planning stages, we are running into many rules and guidelines by the fire marshall and designers of what this structure has to follow in order to have students present using it.  This is driving up the costs considerably.  I am wondering if other schools that have newer greenhouses built recently had to go through a lot of guidelines or if other older structures needed improvements made?  Our main one is fire suppression with a sprinkler system from the ceiling and materials that are more bricks and mortar with glass windows.  Our school wants to do this correctly but I'm not sure we can afford what is being designed.  I know there are grants out there but it's trying to find the time to write them is my problem.  Curious of what others had to face.  Thank you!

--

Mrs. Christine Mackai

4th Grade Elementary and HS Band Director

Northeast Range School

Original Message:
Sent: 12/27/2022 11:06:00 AM
From: Amelia Dupuis
Subject: RE: School Greenhouse

Hey Christine! What size greenhouse are you hoping to build and what is your estimated cost with these requirements (and/or your ideal budget)?

@Nathan Larson, @Erica Krug, and @Hawthorn McCracken are connected with a lot of school gardens in Wisconsin. Do any of you know of any programs with greenhouses that Christine could connect with?  ​

​​​​

------------------------------
Amelia Dupuis
Kids Garden Community Manager
KidsGardening
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-06-2022 11:20:33 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

This is the first time that I am posting a question here as I am needing some info.  I teach at a small northern MN public school and we are wanting to build a greenhouse.  Due to our long winter season, we would like to have it heated and essentially be used year-round.  While in the planning stages, we are running into many rules and guidelines by the fire marshall and designers of what this structure has to follow in order to have students present using it.  This is driving up the costs considerably.  I am wondering if other schools that have newer greenhouses built recently had to go through a lot of guidelines or if other older structures needed improvements made?  Our main one is fire suppression with a sprinkler system from the ceiling and materials that are more bricks and mortar with glass windows.  Our school wants to do this correctly but I'm not sure we can afford what is being designed.  I know there are grants out there but it's trying to find the time to write them is my problem.  Curious of what others had to face.  Thank you!

--

Mrs. Christine Mackai

4th Grade Elementary and HS Band Director

Northeast Range School

Hi Christine, We built a greenhouse from a kit at our school. I worked with the head of Maintenance and Operations. We got it approved without the sprinkler, etc. by calling it a "plant house" and agreeing that the kids would work right outside the structure. Greenhouses can get expensive and I am learning that they need care -a heater and a fan help. We have not electricity near our greenhouse. Ours is 12' by 10' and from Harbor Freight who will give great discounts to school. Not sure this would hold up in your climate. This one gets some wear and tear (doesn't do well with the wind and storms so would be better between building) from our mild Sacramento winter weather. I would look at the website for Gardener's Supply Company and design and make your own.. Maybe a few small greenhouses that sit over a garden bed  or two (wooden frame with glass windows - "protection frames") and buy or build some potting benches. I know it's not the same experience but could be a decent substitute.

------------------------------
Evelyn Margolin
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-27-2022 11:37:15 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

Our school was gifted with a $50,000 trust-donation.  This is such a generous amount and we are so blessed, but I'm not sure if we are going to go down this route so much anymore.  The fire codes are so strict and due to the inflated costs of building materials, the bids that we have gotten back from actual engineered designers are in the tune of $128,000-165,000.  It's crazy.  We just talked to the donor and she is not feeling too well with the high costs.  Another teacher and I are thinking of a "plan B" and would like to convert an empty classroom into an indoor greenhouse instead.  We are also considering building cold frames that can be used outside in late spring.  We are located in NE MN where our above freezing temps overnight won't occur until May, if we are lucky.  So, we would need some kind of heating source in order to use it more than 1 or more during the school year.  So, the indoor classroom thought is looking like a better option.  I am always open to other greenhouse plans however, the way the rules and regulations are presently for us, I don't know if this is going to be feasible.  

Thanks for contacting me and asking!

Original Message:
Sent: 12/27/2022 11:06:00 AM
From: Amelia Dupuis
Subject: RE: School Greenhouse

Hey Christine! What size greenhouse are you hoping to build and what is your estimated cost with these requirements (and/or your ideal budget)?

@Nathan Larson, @Erica Krug, and @Hawthorn McCracken are connected with a lot of school gardens in Wisconsin. Do any of you know of any programs with greenhouses that Christine could connect with?  ​

​​​​

------------------------------
Amelia Dupuis
Kids Garden Community Manager
KidsGardening

Original Message:
Sent: 12-06-2022 11:20:33 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

This is the first time that I am posting a question here as I am needing some info.  I teach at a small northern MN public school and we are wanting to build a greenhouse.  Due to our long winter season, we would like to have it heated and essentially be used year-round.  While in the planning stages, we are running into many rules and guidelines by the fire marshall and designers of what this structure has to follow in order to have students present using it.  This is driving up the costs considerably.  I am wondering if other schools that have newer greenhouses built recently had to go through a lot of guidelines or if other older structures needed improvements made?  Our main one is fire suppression with a sprinkler system from the ceiling and materials that are more bricks and mortar with glass windows.  Our school wants to do this correctly but I'm not sure we can afford what is being designed.  I know there are grants out there but it's trying to find the time to write them is my problem.  Curious of what others had to face.  Thank you!

--

Mrs. Christine Mackai

4th Grade Elementary and HS Band Director

Northeast Range School

Hi Christine,
If you have ruled out the greenhouse, consider building a monarch pollinator garden in the spring with lots of milkweed so students can raise monarchs in the classroom.  Then purchase hydroponic towers to grow food in the school building during winter months.  Fresh salads for lunch!  Herbs to use for sensory/ & cooking.  Reach out & Ill provide all the resources if you want to go in that direction.
warmly,  MaryAnne@MonarchSisterSchools.org. 410-599-2860

------------------------------
Mary Anne Rishebarger
Natural Partners/Monarch Sister Schools Program
Baltimore MD
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-30-2022 07:49:03 PM
From: Evelyn Margolin
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi Christine, We built a greenhouse from a kit at our school. I worked with the head of Maintenance and Operations. We got it approved without the sprinkler, etc. by calling it a "plant house" and agreeing that the kids would work right outside the structure. Greenhouses can get expensive and I am learning that they need care -a heater and a fan help. We have not electricity near our greenhouse. Ours is 12' by 10' and from Harbor Freight who will give great discounts to school. Not sure this would hold up in your climate. This one gets some wear and tear (doesn't do well with the wind and storms so would be better between building) from our mild Sacramento winter weather. I would look at the website for Gardener's Supply Company and design and make your own.. Maybe a few small greenhouses that sit over a garden bed  or two (wooden frame with glass windows - "protection frames") and buy or build some potting benches. I know it's not the same experience but could be a decent substitute.

------------------------------
Evelyn Margolin

Original Message:
Sent: 12-27-2022 11:37:15 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

Our school was gifted with a $50,000 trust-donation.  This is such a generous amount and we are so blessed, but I'm not sure if we are going to go down this route so much anymore.  The fire codes are so strict and due to the inflated costs of building materials, the bids that we have gotten back from actual engineered designers are in the tune of $128,000-165,000.  It's crazy.  We just talked to the donor and she is not feeling too well with the high costs.  Another teacher and I are thinking of a "plan B" and would like to convert an empty classroom into an indoor greenhouse instead.  We are also considering building cold frames that can be used outside in late spring.  We are located in NE MN where our above freezing temps overnight won't occur until May, if we are lucky.  So, we would need some kind of heating source in order to use it more than 1 or more during the school year.  So, the indoor classroom thought is looking like a better option.  I am always open to other greenhouse plans however, the way the rules and regulations are presently for us, I don't know if this is going to be feasible.  

Thanks for contacting me and asking!

Original Message:
Sent: 12/27/2022 11:06:00 AM
From: Amelia Dupuis
Subject: RE: School Greenhouse

Hey Christine! What size greenhouse are you hoping to build and what is your estimated cost with these requirements (and/or your ideal budget)?

@Nathan Larson, @Erica Krug, and @Hawthorn McCracken are connected with a lot of school gardens in Wisconsin. Do any of you know of any programs with greenhouses that Christine could connect with?  ​

​​​​

------------------------------
Amelia Dupuis
Kids Garden Community Manager
KidsGardening

Original Message:
Sent: 12-06-2022 11:20:33 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

This is the first time that I am posting a question here as I am needing some info.  I teach at a small northern MN public school and we are wanting to build a greenhouse.  Due to our long winter season, we would like to have it heated and essentially be used year-round.  While in the planning stages, we are running into many rules and guidelines by the fire marshall and designers of what this structure has to follow in order to have students present using it.  This is driving up the costs considerably.  I am wondering if other schools that have newer greenhouses built recently had to go through a lot of guidelines or if other older structures needed improvements made?  Our main one is fire suppression with a sprinkler system from the ceiling and materials that are more bricks and mortar with glass windows.  Our school wants to do this correctly but I'm not sure we can afford what is being designed.  I know there are grants out there but it's trying to find the time to write them is my problem.  Curious of what others had to face.  Thank you!

--

Mrs. Christine Mackai

4th Grade Elementary and HS Band Director

Northeast Range School

Hi Christine and Amelia! I know of a couple of greenhouses located at middle schools here in Madison, Wisconsin and I would be happy to connect you with the school garden educators if that is of interest! You can email me at erica@rootedwi.org
Best,
Erica

------------------------------
Erica Krug
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-27-2022 11:06:06 AM
From: Amelia Dupuis
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hey Christine! What size greenhouse are you hoping to build and what is your estimated cost with these requirements (and/or your ideal budget)?

@Nathan Larson, @Erica Krug, and @Hawthorn McCracken are connected with a lot of school gardens in Wisconsin. Do any of you know of any programs with greenhouses that Christine could connect with?  ​

​​​​

------------------------------
Amelia Dupuis
Kids Garden Community Manager
KidsGardening

Original Message:
Sent: 12-06-2022 11:20:33 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

This is the first time that I am posting a question here as I am needing some info.  I teach at a small northern MN public school and we are wanting to build a greenhouse.  Due to our long winter season, we would like to have it heated and essentially be used year-round.  While in the planning stages, we are running into many rules and guidelines by the fire marshall and designers of what this structure has to follow in order to have students present using it.  This is driving up the costs considerably.  I am wondering if other schools that have newer greenhouses built recently had to go through a lot of guidelines or if other older structures needed improvements made?  Our main one is fire suppression with a sprinkler system from the ceiling and materials that are more bricks and mortar with glass windows.  Our school wants to do this correctly but I'm not sure we can afford what is being designed.  I know there are grants out there but it's trying to find the time to write them is my problem.  Curious of what others had to face.  Thank you!

--

Mrs. Christine Mackai

4th Grade Elementary and HS Band Director

Northeast Range School

Christine, 
There is a large greenhouse at our local high school in Brainerd, MN that was very recently built. They may be able to help, the ag teachers are in charge of the space. Another great reference is Caroline Venis at Wadena-Deer Creek schools. They have an amazing set of greenhouses (both heated and non heated). Since you are in a similar climate it might be a good connection.
There is a good article about it: https://www.thelandonline.com/news/students-benefit-from-greenhouse-with-knowledge-and-food/article_ae004c24-8015-11ea-ad38-f3f6b03d7190.html
The coordinator's email at school is: cvenis@wdc2155.k12.mn.us

------------------------------
Heidi Auel
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 12-06-2022 11:20:33 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

This is the first time that I am posting a question here as I am needing some info.  I teach at a small northern MN public school and we are wanting to build a greenhouse.  Due to our long winter season, we would like to have it heated and essentially be used year-round.  While in the planning stages, we are running into many rules and guidelines by the fire marshall and designers of what this structure has to follow in order to have students present using it.  This is driving up the costs considerably.  I am wondering if other schools that have newer greenhouses built recently had to go through a lot of guidelines or if other older structures needed improvements made?  Our main one is fire suppression with a sprinkler system from the ceiling and materials that are more bricks and mortar with glass windows.  Our school wants to do this correctly but I'm not sure we can afford what is being designed.  I know there are grants out there but it's trying to find the time to write them is my problem.  Curious of what others had to face.  Thank you!

--

Mrs. Christine Mackai

4th Grade Elementary and HS Band Director

Northeast Range School

Heidi, I read the article. What an amazing project! Sounds like a major addition to the program and something that will be around for years to come.

------------------------------
Evelyn Margolin
(916)501-1173
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 01-04-2023 01:23:54 PM
From: Heidi Auel
Subject: School Greenhouse

Christine, 
There is a large greenhouse at our local high school in Brainerd, MN that was very recently built. They may be able to help, the ag teachers are in charge of the space. Another great reference is Caroline Venis at Wadena-Deer Creek schools. They have an amazing set of greenhouses (both heated and non heated). Since you are in a similar climate it might be a good connection.
There is a good article about it: https://www.thelandonline.com/news/students-benefit-from-greenhouse-with-knowledge-and-food/article_ae004c24-8015-11ea-ad38-f3f6b03d7190.html
The coordinator's email at school is: cvenis@wdc2155.k12.mn.us

------------------------------
Heidi Auel

Original Message:
Sent: 12-06-2022 11:20:33 AM
From: Christine Mackai
Subject: School Greenhouse

Hi.

This is the first time that I am posting a question here as I am needing some info.  I teach at a small northern MN public school and we are wanting to build a greenhouse.  Due to our long winter season, we would like to have it heated and essentially be used year-round.  While in the planning stages, we are running into many rules and guidelines by the fire marshall and designers of what this structure has to follow in order to have students present using it.  This is driving up the costs considerably.  I am wondering if other schools that have newer greenhouses built recently had to go through a lot of guidelines or if other older structures needed improvements made?  Our main one is fire suppression with a sprinkler system from the ceiling and materials that are more bricks and mortar with glass windows.  Our school wants to do this correctly but I'm not sure we can afford what is being designed.  I know there are grants out there but it's trying to find the time to write them is my problem.  Curious of what others had to face.  Thank you!

--

Mrs. Christine Mackai

4th Grade Elementary and HS Band Director

Northeast Range School